Home › Forums › Complicated Situation / Mixed Signals › Is he scared or just not into me?
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Melody.
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MariaTheOriginal
I knew when i posted it that 90% of people would disagree with my advice.
The women on this forum, the vast vast majority of them, have been burned by emotionally unavailable men.
I get it.
But there is a difference between someone truly emotionally unavailable, and someone who is scared and will open up if the other one does first. I have been that person.I think the OP wants, and deserves, clarity.
most of the advice on her is game playing and female emotional manipulation. And it doesn’t appear to have gotten many of the posters that far in their own relationships.
Crisula
@Maria
I myself have never emotionally manipulated , or played games with a poster..and as far as I have witnessed, the majority of others haven’t either.
Each of us come from different walks of life, childhood backgrounds, countries, states..whatever.. and each of us have had different life experiences…both positive and negative.
I think most of us give our best shot at advice, based on how we interpret a poster’s troubling issue…..
A poster can only give us such limited info, and their question is entirely one sided.
Furthermore, to judge many of as useless failures in our own relationships, based on our responses to posters questions, is not only judgmental, but downright nasty.
Jay
Have to agree with ‘haha’ about Lane. I have observations regaridung her posts:
1. She isn’t married and when she was it was a vey king term comdependent situinan
2. Now while she claims she is ‘healed’ and learned fro dad,,l she still ended up in a bad rektionshiomfir many years. And in fact posted a year or so back about whether or not she should take a vacation with same ex.. cause she didn’t trust to not have sex.
My point is anyone on here can present a story of being emotially heakthy, and lane dies a good job at that, but the real facts as she presents them is that she picked a man of addiction to marry – out of all these suitors she says wanted to marry her – and lived a miserable life, now she picks men who aren’t emotionally or physically available to show she can handle distance etc….she sounds like an unemotional man.. lol
I have been married twice and propose to many times too. She seems to take pride in that. And while she gives amazing advice to others, she has no relal love life.. just sime guy away on ‘duty’ that sees her when he can.. she claims this works and yet I don’t beleive that. She isn’t getting any younger and while she consist ut amazing advice, it hasn’t really suited her over the long term,.
Lane
Haha, my strategy didn’t get me into a marriage with a chronic alcoholic. He was NOT an alcoholic when I met him, and he didn’t start to drink heavily until after our 8th year of marriage where he eventually succumbed to alcoholism around two years later. He had dry periods during those two years, but sadly they did not stick. Up until that time, which is when correlates to his military responsibilities increasing with rank and position, we had a really good marriage…he was a very good husband, whereas I had no idea how cruelly alcohol could ruin a person.
I never grew up around alcohol so I had no idea what it involved until he turned into one. I would never wish it on anyone and sadly I had to leave him because I became sick too (co-dependent) which I also wouldn’t wish on anyone either. My personal experiences has helped many women on here poo poo it if you want—I have no regrets because I have two son’s and all I can hope for is that they have a happier ending.
Pandora
Maria, the thing is, the OP will NOT get clarity after her confession…
her first confession will be somehow “rejected”, 99 %
but if she will persist, with strenght not desperation, it may work out
so I am not placing too much importance on her first confession to this man
Lane
Jay, honestly, its my life and I’m fine living it the way I want to and that’s what ultimately matters. Not sure why you care or feel the need to hijack the OP’s post—it my life, my shoes, and my journey…don’t care what you say or believe.
MariaTheOriginal
Crisula- I didn’t say that posters were playing games/emotionally manipulating other posters, I said that people advise posters to do that.
I’m not judging others– I’m just saying “consider the source’ of the advice.
Crisula
@Maria
Then I apologize
MariaTheOriginal
Pandora-
She could very well get rejected. But at least if that is case she can move on.
Others encourage pulling back, letting him take the lead. Probably with that is that lots of men continue to give you just enough to hang on, but not enough to actually have a truly honest open relationship.
I believe in honest communicaton– let the chips fall where they may.
I’d so much rather know if someone wasn’t into me/didn’t want a relationship, than thrash around in the dark. That’s why I’m saying be direct. if this isn’t going to work, a ripping of the bandaid off is better than playing games/coy/elusive/wondering what the other person is thinking for months. On the other hand, just cutting it off without talking is a bad idea too– as she may end up still thinking about him months down the line, wondering what would have happened had she talked to him.Nothing bad comes of being honest. if it gets you rejected, well then, at least you know where the hell you stand!
Lane
OMGosh…is everyone on their periods? OP sorry for all the cattiness that has pervaded your post. There’s a hidden “mean girls club” who comes out of the word work and goes on the attack when one kicks it off, then they all go on the ‘attack’.
Just do what your going to do. That’s all I’m going to say. Peace.
Lane
acck meant “..wood work”
Shannon
I have to say, I don’t always agree with Lane, but she takes the high road which is something that I struggle with. She doesn’t take the trolls personally or stoop down to their level. And the other day someone said something about her looking old which I think was meant to be an insult (and I almost said something, because I don’t think she looks old at all) but she didn’t take it that way. She has confidence.
Maria, I think you need to sometimes think about the way you’re phrasing things. The other day I responded to a poster and you then tried to negate my opinion by saying “Consider the source, poor Shannon has had an awful time of it,” which I thought was degrading and condescending and I ignored.
And when the poster came back and it turned out I was right, I actually had a hard time not saying “I guess the bad source was right,” but I didn’t because it would only upset the OP further when she probably felt bad enough.
Again, I don’t agree with your advice always either but we all have different experiences and viewpoints. Unfortunately mine comes from “I know what men say when they’re trying to get rid of you because I’ve heard it all.”
We all have something to contribute, whether or not we’ve had overwhelming success in our relationships, through our experiences.
peggy
Going with your intuition the best way forward here-if/when you sense a guy is pulling back- he is…so you wait a week or two to see if he comes around and makes a commitment to go forward,no contact in the meantime. If here-engages,great-define the “relationship”. If he does not, then let him go. No one ever got blood from a turnip..
MariaTheOriginal
Shannon– ok, point taken- I can see how it came across that way and I apologize.
I frequent another relationship forum (reddit) and the advice is so much different, that I still maintain “consider the source” is totally valid, and some of the best advice about advice. On the other forum it’s all “healthy relationships are about communication” and men saying things like “don’t wait for him to chase you all the time, men like to be chased too”. It’s just a totally different vibe there for whatever reason.
When I was considering whether or not to get back with my ex, people in my life had different opinions. Mom’s was “be careful!” which makes sense from a Mom. Best friend’s was “I think you guys are meant to be!” but she’s a hopeless romantic… male friend who has a crush on me, well, you can guess.
The only place if ever received truly neutral advice is from a therapist.
I’m sure mine is not neutral either– which is why I always try to include where i’m personally coming from in my response. For example with this one, because I’ve had someone tenderly dismantle my walls, I’m more optimistic on this issue than some might be. And because I’m highly independent and don’t like texting all day I tend to tell people to chill if they haven’t heard from a guy in a couple of days.– but then, yes, a few times it has turned out the guy WAS fading and I was wrong.
I have no problem admitting when I’ve been wrong.Pandora
Maria, but I am saying again: the OP´s first confession is not a make or break thing, she will not move on, if she get rejected, thats what I am saying
she will repeat it, and the first rejection will not get her to move on…. so if she is determined to make this move, then she has to be prepared for the long run and consistency, that may get a result…. or may not
one confession and a possible wishy-washy rejection will not calm her down, even after a rejection…. so it is naive to say: do it, get clarity and you can move on…. she is not going to move on after the confession
OP, I stand by my opinion: if you feel the love and strenght, go for it, brace yourself and you may get him (very possible, you are stable and articulate, so chances are high, if you dont get sucked into some insecurity, it has to be a mission:) )
if you think this one confession is a make or break and you can move on after the rejection, then dont do it (the rejection will be not too straightforward, so you will still have hope and will be at much more emotional turmoil, IF you dont brace yourself and make it a long-term run
its your life, if you feel real love (which is rear), no amount of time is wasted
if you are co-dependent or any other sh*t, let you be co-dependent, who is to say, what is good for the others?if you can take it, go for it, if you dont, then dont
PS. stop attacking each other! and mainly, dont attack Lane, its so lame, she is very cool
Shoshannah
I think Pandora gave the greatest advice.
Melody, go for it if you think this is the thing to do. The biggest worry is that you may face explicit rejection, which you could avoid if you gave it more time. But maybe it’s better for you to get it all sorted soon.I don’t think you’re chasing him, I think you’re standing up for yuorself. It is a risk – you are risking rejection. But it also shows very strong boundaries.
On a different note… what is it, all the discussions about L or Lane? I love input from both Lane’s and L’s, I think they are unique and very helpful. Why going off topic to discuss their private lives?
Maria, everyone should always consider their source of advice – this doesn’t mean that you have to humiliate others.
Actually I have once heard an opinion of a very famous psychologist – that it is very bad to listen to your friends advice, even worse to go to online forums. The presumption obviously was that people don’t know a half of the story, that other posters are projecting etc. I see his point, but I also don’t see anything wrong with trying to get other people’s opinions. You always have to consider your source, and take into accunt that people only know a small bit. But it still can be useful to you. On this or any other forum. I don’t see a point in making a point of it – any reasonable human being will take this (all the differences, the limits of online communication) into account.
Good luck OP! You sound stable and reasonable. I am optimistic, meaning I think you will do what is best for you.
Melody
Guys, I’m beyond excited about all of your replies! I can’t tell you how much I appreciate it, and I’ve read through every advice so many times.
But right now I can’t get back to all of you and respond – even though you deserve it.
You see, I have a bit of news … And I’m afraid the majority of you were right, since it’s not good news. Frankly, I’m heartbroken.
So I’ve been trying for about two weeks now to get some alone time with him. Well, he’s been busy. And he is really busy, BUT I just asked to see him for a quick chat. He kept saying stuff like “Oh, stop by this weekend” and then I wouldn’t here from him. So when today he didn’t answer my text where I asked when he could see me, I had enough and I went to see him.
And boy, it did not go well … I told him I felt like he had been avoiding me lately, that I missed talking to him and spending time together, and that it would make me happy if he would make some time for me this weekend. He kept putting me off with “I’ve been busy”, and in the end I just shrugged and said I didn’t know what to say anymore. And then it got bad.
“One more thing. I don’t want to take this relationship any further. I told you right from the beginning: I don’t want a relationship. I made that VERY clear. I’m too busy for a relationship, I haven’t been in a relationship for more than 7 years, I’m not ready, I will not be ready, I don’t want a relationship! It has nothing to do with you, and everything to do with me. Am I making myself clear?”
I was mortified. His eyes were filled with both anger and hurt, his tone was mean and his body language closed and defensive. And I just stood there. I can only imagine how my face changed while he was speaking, and if just 1% of the heartbreak I felt could be seen on my face, he would be able to tell that he completely crushed me.
He then went on to say something about how I treated him as if he was my boyfriend when all he wanted was to be my friend. That really got to me and I got defensive as well.
“Well, that’s not really true though, is it?! You know we were more than just friends. Would you say we have been just friends these past months!?” He looked down. “No, I guess we’ve been dating”. Okay, well, I’m not a complete fool then.
He did most of the talking, though. He told me how I didn’t act as a friend towards him, how he DID NOT want a relationship, how I would feel if I saw him with someone else, bla bla bla. He didn’t let me talk and then he got in his car (he was in a hurry. I knew that. I just wanted to schedule a time to talk when all of this exploded in my face.) I asked him if he really didn’t feel anything and he responded: “No. I never feel anything”. Then I told him I still wanted to talk to him and he said “I have nothing more to say” and I said “well, I do, not all is about you. And you don’t have to say anything. I need to say something” and he told me okay, and let’s do it Sunday.
Melody
Guys, I don’t even know where to begin … First of all, this man has more serious issues than I ever thought. I mean, he talks a lot about wanting kids and a family, but then he DOES NOT want a relationship. He also tried to put the blame on me for acting like he’s my boyfriend, when HE was the one who constantly wanted me to stay over, told me I was “his girl”, that he didn’t want anybody else to see me naked, HE wanted to start watching a TV show together, HE brought me to meet his friends and so on … And his friends have embraced me like I’m his girlfriend since he hasn’t brought another girl with him before. So they say, anyway. And all of them always ask me about him and his well-being and whereabouts, as if I know all of that (as if I’m his girlfriend).
The whole thing about him not feeling anything isn’t completely true either. I know he did. And I saw how it scared him and made him pull away. And now he’s convinced himself that he feels nothing at all. Fair enough. But I know it’s not true. He’s very easy to read, all of his emotions are so apparent on his face. And tonight he was pissed off because I think he felt like I was the one trying to pressure him into something he doesn’t want.
Ok, look. I’m not saying that he was ever in love with me. I don’t know that. I don’t even think he’s in a stage where he can fall in love. I could sense that he was very surprised by our connection – if it was love, fascination or simply just really good chemistry, I’ll never know. All I know is that we got really close, and then he freaked out and stopped seeing me. And made this story in his mind about how I was acting like his girlfriend while he acted “completely normal”. He said that, actually. And that was all he needed to place the blame on me and therefore acting pissed tonight.
Honestly, I feel like I’ve taken a physical beating. Maybe even worse. He was stripped from compassion, he was demeaning and controlling and downright disrespectful to me. He raised his voice like I was a child who had done something wrong, and he kept saying “Is that clear?” as if I didn’t understand English anymore. I felt mistreated and like he didn’t listen to me, and that’s why I told him I still wanted to tell him something. And I do. I feel misunderstood and judged, and I need to tell him what I experienced. And when I’ve done that, and told him what I’m looking for, I’m walking away. He can then think about it and if he wants anything, he knows where to find me. And if not (which is what’s going to happen) he can stay away.
Ladies, I’m shocked. When I walked off, he drove up to me, rolled his window down and was back to his sweet self “How far is your car? Do you want me to drive you to it? It’s late, I don’t want anything to happen to you.” “No.” “Okay, be careful and goodnight”. I felt the waterworks coming and as soon as I heard him drive away, tears streamed down my cheeks. I drove home with blurry vision, as the tears kept flowing.
The stupidest part now is that all I can think is how bad I feel for him that he is this way. I wish he would wake up and realize that he has some serious issues that he should really work on. I’m not saying he should end up with me, but just imagine being THAT closed off. “I will never want a relationship,” he said. Wow. He is messed up. And at 37 years old that is just messed up.
Luckily, I’m confident enough that I honestly think it’s his problem and not something I did wrong. I know the potential I see, and I know he felt something, but nothing I could have done or been would have made him want a relationship. He’s simply not capable of it, I think. At that breaks my heart for him.
And yes, I still want to give him my little speech. And you are all very free to judge that decision and say that I’m only getting myself hurt more, but honestly, I don’t think that’s possible. Right now I feel empty inside – like every emotion has left my body. But his crazy, defensive self wouldn’t let me talk so I need to get this off my chest and then I will leave him be. And if – by some miracle – he decides to work on himself and will want something from me, I will be willing to give him one last chance. And that’s it.
Oh God, I wish I had better news. I feel like this is the worst news possible! I can’t believe this happened tonight … Wow.
Xx Melody
Lane
Oh Melody, I warned you it would not go well.
Please I beg of you DO NOT talk to him again! He doesn’t CARE what you have to say whereas anything you do say will just piss him off more!!! He couldn’t be more straightforward and direct with you and you STILL want to “talk it out” with him after this?!?!
Please get some self-respect and stop forcing him to feel something he doesn’t feel, never did, and never will. I know your hurting but you are doing it to yourself dear and its high time to stop the pain by walking away and blocking him from your life FOREVER.
Melody
Lane, I don’t want to TALK to him. I don’t want him to say anything, I don’t need him to. I have self-respect. I don’t care if it pisses him off more, I’m only doing this for me. We will see. I feel ridiculous to contact him after this.
He told me he wanted me to act like his friend and that we should be friends. I don’t remember if I even responded to that. He said it was either sex or friendship and that we couldn’t mix the two – which is what we’ve been doing for the past months, and solely by his initiative.
Kayla
I’m sorry it worked out this way for you. In know youndont see it, but he told you very early in that ‘relationships are boring’ and that he didn’t want one. He was negative about relationships, so this response from him, looking from the outside actually makes sense. He could tell you were getting too invested and he pulled back. Also, the words you used were that this was a ‘roller coaster’ relationship. I can tell you first hand that this is recipe for disaster. In the early months of dating all should be infatuation and fun on both sides. When things are off balance or up and down, this means it’s not a relationship of two people with the same goal.
You can analyze this to death, and I know you are. But men say things in the moment, all the time. It doesn’t mean a thing unless backed up by actions, you don’t really know this man, you only dated him a few months, and meeting friends means nothing, this guy screamed emotionally unavailable from the start and you lowed ahead because you based things on potential and not reality. In my experience when you do this, you always lose.
I don’t think you should talk with him anymore. He was abrupt with you because he wanted you to get the fact this isn’t going anywhere, I’m not there, but I sense even from this thread you have a hard time letting go. You want what you want and will do your Whatever you have to in order to push your own agenda. You just showing up at his home must have been beyond upsetting for him, when a person blatantly ignores you or says he doesn’t want to see you, that isn’t your clue to just show up.
I would let this go, I understand you are very invested in this man, but he has made his position clear. Please don’t project your own feelings on him. Most people that prefer being single are not in pain or sorry for their decision. That’s just you talking in your head. I doubt this man wants or is interested in you giving him a lecture on what’s best for him or what he is missing out on. Focus on you. Learn from this.
Kayla
And regarding him comment about sex and friend, you were a fwb. And I don’t think he really wants to be your platonic friend. I would advise you not be a friend but delete his contact info and move on, staying in contact at any level is not in your best interest,
Melody
Kayla, you’re so right. And that’s why I went on this forum, because as I stated before I’m not really experienced in the whole dating world. Last time I dated somebody I was 17! And I’ve always just not cared for guys unless I had fallen really hard for them. Which this guy is the third one. All other guys I just don’t care about. I get asked out a lot, but I feel absolutely nothing. Nothing at all. With this man I felt everything.
He said a lot of negative things about relationships, but he also said a lot of good things about them. Please, I’m not insane and just pulling stuff out of thin air. We talked a lot about marriage too, and he asked for my view on a lot of different things in relationships and he said that he had never met someone who saw it like he did too. I told him once that if he really thought relationships were just another problem, then he had been in the wrong one, and that the right relationship makes everything easier, better and more meaningful. And then he proceeded to ask a lot of questions about relationships and told me it sounded wonderful and that he should sort his head out.
I didn’t show up at his home, but you are right. I felt terrible but I also felt like I needed an answer right now. his friends do the same thing, but I really didn’t feel good about it.
I don’t want to lecture him. I have told him my position on relationships before, I have no need to tell him what I think he should do with his life. It’s his life and his decision. He can do as he pleases. I want to tell him how I feel, how I work and what this whatever we had meant to me. It has nothing to do with him. I feel like he’s made me out to be this crazy woman who’s trying to make him my boyfriend by force, but that’s not the truth. Most of the “couply” things we’ve done together have been all him. In the beginning, I was the one distancing myself, because I respected the fact that he didn’t want a relationship. But then he brought me everywhere and he started treating me like I was his, and yes then I started to act more like his girlfriend. But only then! And then he got freaked out once he told me all about his childhood and his late mother and how much she meant to him. And since then he has pulled away and shut down.
Oh well. I need to sleep. My head is spinning.
Kayla
Please stop thinking you can read his mind, you don’t know he ‘freaked out’ after sharing info about his mother or childhood. That’s your interpretation, he was pulling back because he realized you were acting like a gf.
Please note, that you stated he started doing more couply things once you relaxed your position on being a gf. That’s a huge clue for you. It means that he was under the impression you were cool with just a fwb relationship. This happens all the time. If the man doesn’t want a relationship and the woman agrees to keep it casual, he thinks you are both on the same page. Next time, don’t be so ready to accept casual if you really want more, you went with the flow hoping he would change his mind. You even attempted to convince him he hadn’t met the right woman. He should be the one convincing you.
Crisula mentioned early on he sounded like a narcissist. I tended to agree because of all the things you described in your first post… especially the comment about roller coaster. That’s not normal for a healthy relationship. And it’s classic feeling from someone dealing with a narcissist. Of course, no one here can diagnose such a thing, but it warrants mentioning, especially when he had his final blow up with you. Not to sound cruel, but he has no further use for you and he may already have moved on to another woman. Please just let this one go.
Shannon
Melody, you should have given him your little speech when you had the opportunity the other day. I have a feeling he’s not going to meet with you on Sunday. Why would he? What can he possibly say that hasn’t already been said? Nothing you say now will make a difference.
Trust me, I have been in this place with way too many men before and I know now that a lot of it has to do with my lack of ability to walk away from a toxic situation and let things go. That is why I suggest examining what is causing you to hang on when there is no hope. Emotionally healthy people do not want people who don’t want them. Because it’s a recipe for disaster and pain.
He’s rejected you. WHY, who knows. Maybe he had feelings for you, maybe he doesn’t, maybe he’s scared…but the common denominator is he does not want a relationship with you.
You feel sad for him, but this is the life he has chosen and clearly he enjoys it and it makes him happy. Society believes that everyone who is not in a relationship is lonely and miserable, but if that were the case we wouldn’t have so many people trying to avoid one. He likes his life the way it is.
My fear for you is if that you continue to pursue him for any reason, even to to give your little closure speech, you risk a permanent blow to your self esteem and feeling of self worth that may take a long time to heal. How many times do you need to be told that someone doesn’t want your love? Being told that is soul crushing, you’re already in a great deal of pain, why are you being a glutton for punishment? No more. Do your healing, cry your tears, and do not chase this man anymore. The longer you drag this out, the longer it will take for you to start the healing process.
If you still have something to say to him, write it to us. Or write a letter to him. And burn it. He doesn’t want what you’re offering. Please, walk away with some semblance of your dignity intact. At this point if you continue you are going to be BEGGING him. Please don’t do that to yourself. No man is worth that.
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