Am I his rebound? Is it going well?


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  • #934224 Reply

    Poppy

    Hey lovely peeps!

    I recently got out from a long term relationship with my ex ( he has aspersers). The breakup was hard but I’ve moved on(he cheated!) and started dating again.

    Last month I met this guy who I had instant connection with – we have a lot common interests and I found him attractive. He’s told me that he enjoys talking to me very much and that he found me very attractive and engaging. He’d check in with me almost every day via texting and say good morning/good night. He’s also got out of a long term relationship not long ago (his ex broke up with him in March). I’m the first woman he’s seeing after the breakup.

    Our first meeting went very well. We met in a park and then went for lunch nearby. He did a lot extra strolling with me than planned and walked to me my next meeting point until we had to say goodbye because my friend was there waiting. After our first date I told him that I like him and would like to continue seeing him. He said he felt the same but he doesn’t want to hurt me because he’s still recovering from the last relationship and it still hurts. He went on suggesting us to hang out as friends first and see how things develop. I felt I had no other options so I agreed to give him time and continue to “hang out with the understanding that this could head somewhere more serious”. He agreed.

    He initiated the second date and invited himself over to my place on a Sunday morning to taste test these hipster coffee beans he’s got and volunteered himself to help with my garden project. We had a lovely time. I cooked breakfast and we had coffee together following with the gardening project together. Before he came over he told me he’d need to leave at around 1pm. And again, he overstayed. He ended up cancelling his lunch plan with his brother. I was saying “it’s okay if you need to leave” and he replied “it’s okay I want to stay and hang out”. I was teasing him that he didn’t hug me back at the end of our first meeting(he was very stiff when I gave him a friendly goodbye hug). He said he wanted to give me another proper one and asked me to show him how to hug. I did and it was super awkward. We were sitting on the couch and when I turned to give him the hug, his body was pulling back into the corner of the couch, he didn’t squeeze back and again was super stiff! But throughout the date he did try to touch me here and there – at one point he poked my stomach when I said I feel full and sleepy after lunch. We did talk about kissing, randomly. He told me he’s never the one who initiated and his ex was the one who initiated the first kiss. I told him I’m the same! So no kiss on the second date even though I was feeling the chemistry and the tension the entire time, which was super confusing because I was under the impression that we were still hanging out as friends as we’ve agreed?

    He then went on a road trip with an old friend and would briefly text me at night. After he got back his frequency of texting dropped a bit – no good morning text anymore. I imagine he was very busy prepping for the trip and wrapping up work? He’s on another weekend trip with friends this week(likely planned before we met). But before he left he asked to catch up next week and we planned our third date. This time he booked a dinner place on Saturday night(no more early morning dates, yay!) I look forward to it very much! I am a little infatuated with him at the moment because my gut has been telling me he is very likely “the one” since our very first meeting. My ex hurt me a lot(mostly due to his autism traits) so I want to be super careful this time. It’s only been a month but I already feel quite obsessed. However I do not want to get too attached with someone who’s not ready yet. He’s also said he doesn’t want to hurt me in the beginning(what does that even mean?). A friend told me that if a guy said something like that it means he’s gonna hurt you and he’s not that into you. I do not want to be his rebound fling.

    Btw I do enjoy my single life and have a good support network so I am not desperate to get into another relationship but this guy ticks many boxes and I do like him a lot!

    Any insights, suggestions? Am I his rebound? Any red flags I should watch out for?

    Thanks!

    xx

    #934225 Reply

    M

    So I’m intrigued to hear what other replies you’ll get. But just by virtue of the timeframe and what he said to you, you’re definitely a rebound.

    Doesn’t mean it can’t work of course. But I’d just go super super slow if I were you…

    Also, infatuation will tell you he’s the one (what a great feeling that is. Hard not to get won over by it isn’t it?) but your truth is, you can’t possibly really know this early. You know so little about him at this point.

    And what does “the one” even really mean?

    So I admit, I’m a hypocrite a little bit, because I love using the term myself. But really, Poppy, I feel now that “the one” means the one you choose because they’re kind loving virtuous/principled, sexy AND compatible with you. The one with whom your lives can align well together. The one who brings out the best in you and you bring out the best in him. The one that, no matter how bad things get or how rough life gets, you can trust that they’ve got your back and it’s natural for you to have theirs. The one who isn’t perfect, but when they (or you) make mistakes, they’re not real breakers and instead they way they are means that you ultimately grow together in a good and great way.

    To know if they’re truly the one, you’ve got to see how they show up over a period of time and in a variety of different situations.

    Don’t let feelings fool you, even strong ones. Keep your head even whilst you enjoy the romance. You can bet your bottom dollar he is doing precisely this.

    Tread carefully and protect your heart. He’s warned you already – I’d pay heed. Just because he likes you and fancies you too, doesn’t mean the warning he gave has gone away.

    Maybe I’m being too cautious, but I’ve been on both sides of the equation, and there were always tears ultimately….

    Doesn’t mean that’s what’s going to happen here of course. Just, be careful that’s all. When someone tells you something negative about where they’re at, believe them. Even if they contradict themselves in behaviour afterwards.

    #934226 Reply

    M

    *deal breakers (not real breakers)

    Apologies for all typos.

    #934227 Reply

    Poppy

    Dear M,

    Thank you for the wisdom!! my brain tells me to be cautious and careful but my feelings are all over the place.

    Could you please elaborate on how to “go super super slow”? do I push him away until he’s completely over his ex? Should I just check in with him after a few dates to see where he’s at before we get physical?

    Poppy

    #934232 Reply

    M

    Oh boy, now that’s a million dollar question!

    Care to help me out here Eric and ladies? 🤞

    Okay, so he’s not pushing it physically anyway right, and he’s shy. So what would happen if you just let it continue as is. I mean he’s not imposing a physical relationship on you, so what is there to actually push away?

    The question at this moment in time sounds like, can YOU hold it back??

    I personally have quite strong opinions about getting physical. But I know not everyone prescribes to them so I’m a bit nervous of saying it.

    Anyway, since you asked, here goes. If it were me, I wouldn’t get physical at all yet. If you think your feelings are all over the place now, you can bet they’ll only overwhelm your rational brain more if physical intimacy comes into the mix.

    The honourable gentleman in him has already warned you off right? He said just hang out as friends initially.

    Now if you could stick to that at least until he tells you he’s in love with you and wants to go exclusive, you’re onto a winner. Then you can let go and go wild with the physical love because you’ve eliminated the risk he’ll hurt you (as much as it’s possible of course).

    But if you start getting physical before he’s fallen for you hook line and sinker AND committed, it’s just risky and you’re not on stable ground. He could walk at any moment if someone else catches his eye, because after all he’s not committed to you right?

    And it would hurt a ton more because the more you give of yourself – especially sex, your biological set-up as a woman means you’ll be committed to a man who doesn’t return the compliment. It could break your heart and then you’ll be courting only pain, misery and suffering.

    Eric talks a lot about how sex impacts women differently to men, and it’s worth understanding this deeply.

    It’s a different approach to current popular opinion though. Think you can manage it? And ignore all those well-meaning yet ignorant girlfriends that keep asking, have you kissed/slept with him yet.

    If you can manage it, you’re golden. You’ve given yourself the best possible chance of this being really special and going the full way.

    And before you ask, will a guy stick around if you don’t have sex with him? And is it possible for a guy to fall in love with you when you haven’t even kissed let alone had sex?

    I can tell you from personal experience that I was shocked to realise, yes!

    The ones that don’t, well. If they don’t think you’re worth sticking around for just because they can’t get in your pants, well. Are they really the ones you would want?

    Anyway, that’s just my take on it. I think I’m in the minority!

    I think he’s got mixed feelings for you. Watch out for those. He’ll want to get physical but with his caveat still in place. And you know once you get physical you’re only going to get deeper and deeper in this.

    See where I’m going here…?….

    #934235 Reply

    Poppy

    Dear M,

    Thanks again for the insights!!!

    Yes I completely agree with you on how getting physical early on could mix things up usually not in a good way as I had such experience :(

    I think he’d want to kiss me next time after our dinner date and I would like to kiss him to see if there is indeed a spark. I don’t think I’d get much more attached after a kiss(I could be wrong tho). Is that still too risky?

    I do not feel comfortable having sex with him this early on. I’d need to know him a lot better.

    I also have the urge to tell him go see other women to gain better perspectives and so that I am not his rebound – is that just me being silly?

    Poppy

    #934237 Reply

    M

    Oh boy, guys I need your help! Where are you Eric and ladies???!?

    Is a kiss still too risky?

    Hmmm. You know, for me it definitely would be. But my backstory isn’t you’re average one. So maybe not for you? What do You think? What does your past experience tell you? How do you tend to behave and respond in these situations?

    This is a great chance to get to know yourself actually. I so love that your asking questions and staying rational!

    There’s something to be said for keeping him wanting a little, you know, amping up the tension. Haha, it’ll get him obsessing about you that little bit more….!

    I guess the question is really how cool can you stay? Be honest and real with yourself.

    (I totally can’t! So I miss out on a lot of kissing 🙁 but I save myself a lot of pain and heartbreak 😊☺️🥰 💖)

    Sorry, that’s not a clear answer! Just think back to past relationships and be as objective as possible.

    I think its is more important to really think about this in this situation with this guy because he’s already warned you so we know already that there’s a much much much bigger risk that he’s going to hurt you.

    With respect to urging him to see other women – no, I personally definitely would not do that. We want him to focus and fall in love with you and only you right. Why bring other women into the mix?

    Truth be told Poppy, he hasn’t committed to you so he doesn’t need any encouraging to look around I can promise you that.

    Just because he seems into you now, doesn’t mean he still will be next week or even in two days time.

    He already knows he’s single and he’s actually effectively told you that he intends to stay that way at the moment.

    Be really clear in your mind that he’s 100% single and you’re 100% single yourself until he explicitly and expressly says he wants to be in a committed relationship with you.

    You’re a million miles away from this at the moment. Don’t encourage him to look elsewhere. Let’s encourage him subtly and magnetically to realise what an amazing hot catch you are.

    Then you can decide afterwards whether you think he’s worth keeping, or throwing back into the sea. Always remember, you’re having fun but overall you’re still assessing him, right. This is the time to be discerning and critical. Especially with this one. He needs to step up and show you he’s worth your time.

    (And remember to keep looking yourself! The One you’re looking for, might actually be out there still. We don’t know if this one’s a red herring or not.)

    Sometimes, going slow means savouring and allowing the magic and romance to really spread out so you get to enjoy it more. The beginnings always fun, don’t be in a rush to get anywhere. It’s the journey remember….

    #934238 Reply

    M

    PS I don’t think you’re silly at all. I think you’re really smart and asking smart questions. I wish I had been like you when I was younger!!!

    #934239 Reply

    M

    PPS think about what he means when he said he doesn’t want to hurt you.

    I mean, seriously, what does that even mean?

    My interpretation from what you’ve said is, he wants to get close and intimate with you, but he’s not looking for a committed exclusive relationship. That’s how he’d hurt you.

    I could be wrong, but I feel like he just initially went on that first date with you to get back in the saddle again and allow someone else to distract him and make him feel less sad and less like a loser because his last relationship failed.

    He doesn’t want to deal with real relationship stuff at the moment. He just wants someone temporarily to help him feel better whilst he’s feeling like crap.

    That’s where’s he’s at at the moment.

    And if the last relationship was meaningful to him, this isn’t going to be quick to get over. No matter how great or amazing you are. Even then.

    #934240 Reply

    Poppy

    Thanks for all the kindness and words of wisdom, M. I’m so glad that I went on the forum and got to talk to you.

    I should’ve asked him to clarify what he meant by he doesn’t want to hurt me. My interpretation from our first conversation was that he hasn’t completely moved on yet and he could get back with his ex if she asked to reconnect. He admitted that he “wouldn’t know how to react” in that situation and that he’s hurt a lot by her but he loved her for so long that it’s very conflicting. He said he was ready to propose but his ex at some point decided she wasn’t happy anymore and wasn’t willing to work on things. So she asked him to move out and ended the relationship rather abruptly. Tbh, I don’t think he’s got a clear idea why exactly the relationship ended. They were university sweethearts but did a lot of long distance before they finally moved in together before Covid. They were together for 12 years! He seems to think it’s mostly because he could get “hot tempered” sometimes with her. I want to dig into it a little more with him when it’s appropriate.

    Then on the second date he told me that he’s trying hard to move on and he feels better day by day, and that he doesn’t see the relationship saveable as there was too much hurt.

    I encouraged him to talk to a therapist, shared some resources with him and lent him my book on attachment theory so helpfully he could sort it out for himself soon 🤞🤞🤞.

    #934241 Reply

    Poppy

    And M, I think you’re right that he’s not ready for a committed relationship yet, as when I asked him if he’s ready to date, he first said “I think so” and then said “I’m not sure.”
    He asked me to not view our first meeting as a date and tried to downplay it in texting. However when we met in person, the mutual attraction was obvious and it totally didn’t feel like we were just being friends. I guess that’s how his “mixed feelings” show.

    I don’t know how much longer I could/should wait for him to clear his head tho. It’s hard for me to date multiple people at the same time so the opportunity cost could be high.

    #934245 Reply

    Maddie

    Poppy, I think your main issue here is you’re trying to control what cannot be controlled, in an attempt to avoid repeating pain like you had in your last relationship. You’re framing your descriptions as finding the “right” way to date him, so he doesn’t get scared but you avoid being his rebound.

    So here’s some other perspective. He just got out of a 12 year relationship, and he doesn’t quite understand why it didn’t work out. I strongly suspect it was related to him not proposing after 12 years. Sure, if they met in university, then they may have wanted to wait and not get married in their 20s. But he must be at least 30 now, and was only just ready to propose once she was so unhappy she was ready to break up with him? And still isn’t sure what went wrong that resulted in her ending the relationship “abruptly,” even though it may have also been his hot temper? It took him 12 years to get to that point with her, but you’re wondering if giving him a few weeks will be enough time for him to get in a better mindset for a new relationship.

    He also said he wants to be *friends* first, but you described all your subsequent hangouts as “dates” and are thinking through how fast you should move physically. Is he calling them dates? You can’t be just friends while also trying to figure out your game plan for getting him to come around to where you want him to be. It sounds like you’re on two very different pages about where you’re both at and what you both want and when.

    Moving slow, especially in this case, means dropping all expectations or attachment to outcomes. It’s being curious about him and who he is, open to whoever that may be without projecting anything on him (he’s not “the one,” he’s not a check list of boxes, he’s just a guy you don’t know much about yet). It’s not, seeing him as a potential boyfriend if you just wait 5 dates before you kiss and let him date other people first. You can’t control any of that. All you can do is build a connection, familiarity and trust, while being honest with yourself about if you want the same things and are compatible.

    He doesn’t sound ready for dates or your romantic emotional investment in him yet, though building a connection by getting to know who he is and if you actually like who that person is is okay if that’s what you want to do. I’d be wary, since you trying to plot out exactly how to approach this suggests to me that you will be very hurt if you begin getting physically intimate with him. He knows you’re on different pages too, or he wouldn’t have given you an early warning. But he’s assuming you’ll take responsibility for your own feelings and not get carried away if you know that’s not where he’s at.

    I personally don’t think you should stop meeting new people to pursue this. But I also think you will have more success if you spend more time on healing from your past, in the sense of building up your own self-esteem, identity, and self-worth so that you’re no longer afraid of getting hurt because you know you have your own back no matter what a guy does! You said you have a support network and your own life, and that’s great! Lean into your friends, do things that make you feel good about yourself and connected to the people you care about, explore what gives you a sense of accomplishment or enjoyment, remember your worth even if you ex took you for granted! This guy is going to jerk you around, not intentionally, but he’s got to get over 12 years and he has barely started and probably is at a loss for who he even is (he’s never been single as an adult! I don’t even mean dating around, I mean figuring out who he himself is on his own!). If your connection is as instantly strong as you think, let him go do his thing, and he will get back in touch when he’s ready. Or if he doesn’t, it just means he wasn’t “the one,” and there’s a better fit for you coming your way.

    #934248 Reply

    Poppy

    Dear Maddie,

    Thank you so much for sharing your perspective with me! I actually had run through all the points you raised in my head before I came to the forum however my emotions and feelings got in the way. I’m so glad to hear it from someone else!

    I think he has started treating our meeting as dates since the second one, esp. he wants to meet for dinner on a Saturday night and has suggested us trying a cocktail bar afterwards. But it doesn’t change the possibility that he might just be jerking around even unintentionally.

    Yes agreed to take time to get to know each other and build connections first without developing physical intimacy until he’s ready. I guess the hard part for me was each time when we meet it felt amazing and I had a hard time not to fantasise 🙈

    You’re right tho – my self-worth is still slowly bouncing back after my ex.

    I’m so glad all your responses run deep and focus on the long game. Huge appreciation!

    #934249 Reply

    Runi

    Any guy that tells you he doesn’t want to hurt you at the very beginning of everything will most likely hurt you.

    I say this because in his mind he has already warned you that he might.

    So from the begining he wasn’t 100% in.

    #934250 Reply

    Poppy

    Hey Runi,

    Yes I’m gonna take that warning seriously! I’m also keeping my options open with other people :)

    #934252 Reply

    Liz Lemon

    Everything Maddie said. There’s no way this guy is ready to date if he just ended a 12 year relationship 3 months ago! From what you said they were living together? So he’s barely even started living alone. And you can’t possibly know he’s “the one” after only 1 month and 3 dates.

    M has a great point that you need to get to know a guy over time, and in a variety of situations and circumstances, before you really know him.

    He’s told you he wants to be friends and isn’t over his last relationship. Believe him!

    #934253 Reply

    Poppy

    Hey Liz,

    Yes! I’m absorbing all the wisdoms here 🧠 :)
    Speaking of being “the one” – it was just my gut feeling which is usually pretty spot-on as proven in the past. I am a perceptive person. But this is too serious a matter to just follow my gut.

    In their 12 year relationship they spent most of the time apart because he wanted to prioritise his career ( he had moved around quite a bit across the globe). and I believe when they were apart he’s living by himself. But yeah he’s not been single EVER until recently.

    I’ll stay in the friend zone as everyone has suggested!

    #934260 Reply

    Maddie

    It sounds like you’re doing the wise thing to be thinking this through and recognizing there’s more to this situation than what your emotions are telling you. Emotions are a good guide, and I’m sure your instincts are right that there’s a strong feeling of connection, but it’s good to keep in mind that they are telling you something for a reason but are not the solid truth on their own.

    In regards to what you’re saying about developing physical intimacy when he’s ready, also remember that you can and always should respect his feelings and needs, but you should not try to plan, anticipate, or mindread them, or ignore your own needs. (If your needs are in fundamental conflict with his, then it’s better to walk away romantically-speaking.) If he’s telling you one thing, that he wants to be friends, but acting another way, flirty and like more than friends, it means two things. It means his inconsistency is reflecting either his inner conflict (this can happen from lack of emotional availability) or deep down him wanting to keep things casual and liking what you have — in general, inconsistency shows not being available for a serious relationship with you. Since he’s an adult, you should not have to mindread, guess/assume, or be confused, because you need to be able to communicate well with each other for things to work. (I think you already recognize this as you recommended some therapy resources, and you don’t want to fall into a therapist role for him, that’s definitely rebound territory.) And the second thing is, when faced with a situation like that where the other person’s words and actions are not aligned, I’ve learned that you should always believe the more “negative” of the words / actions / feelings. I’ve wasted years of my own time on several different “partners” thinking I will believe the actions and feelings over the words (constantly acting like a serious boyfriend yet not verbally fully committing) because everyone says actions speak louder. But this is truly not the case, after seeing it through so many different times. When there is inconsistency, listen to whatever your instinct is telling you you’d rather not hear, and use that information to figure out what’s best for you.

    Keep asking the right questions like you are doing and checking in with yourself and your gut about what’s going on here :)

    #934264 Reply

    Poppy

    Thank you for the super helpful suggestions!

    Your answers made me want to have a talk with him at our third meeting just so that we could get on the same page. Cause right now I want to hang out with him but I’m not sure which would fall into the “just being friends” category and which would be more than friends, for example, would it be too much if I ask him out for a movie in the cinema? Would it be too much to see him twice a week than once a week?? I’m also a little confused as to how to react if he took the initiative in behaving more than friends – do I stop him or do I remain unresponsive?

    I guess I tend to overthink when I’m stressed out about stuff.

    #934265 Reply

    M

    Hi Poppy

    Just a quick one before I have to dash today – after reading your reply to my last post, I felt like I wanted to say to you “give this one a wide berth!”

    Can’t write more at mo because have to dash, but essentially I agree with everything everyone else has written here. Some super valuable perspectives offered and shared for you.

    My concern is….

    Well I’m going to be simple and direct purely because of time:

    Everyone here says, you’re heading for disaster if you start courting this guy wanting something to happen.

    It feels like intellectually you get it and you can agree.

    But your questioning in this last post almost suggests, nothings really changed for you in essence. You’re still trying to manage the situation, because you still have the same thoughts of desire in your head.

    I feel a little like I’m watching a train wreck in process.

    Because of your physical and emotional attraction to this guy, and the fact that he feels desire too but minus the desire to be a boyfriend – I just can’t see how you can hang out with him and just be friends.

    The more time you spend with this guy, the more you’re setting yourself up to act on the growing sexual tension. You both feel it – it’s just that only one of you wants it to lead to boyfriend/girlfriend situation, the other doesn’t.

    Guess what’s going to happen, it doesn’t matter how you dress it up or what you call it or how many times a week you see each other – the fact is you both have the hots for each other, and it’s only heading in one direction. He’s told you, I’m going to hurt you – so he’s transferred responsibility for his actions onto you if you decide to get involved.

    I just don’t see how you can hang out with him currently and this not screw with your head and heart???

    #934266 Reply

    Poppy

    Hmm, I thought the takeaway was to 1) take time to get to know him better 2) not let it develop into anything physical too soon and 3) not have expectations that this can be anything serious anytime soon 4) keep seeing other people

    M, are you suggesting me to stop meeting him until he’s over his last relationship and 100% ready for a new relationship? I don’t know how he could fall for me if we stopped hanging out? 🧐

    Poppy

    #934267 Reply

    Poppy

    Oh I see…

    You suspect what I couldn’t handle the emotional turbulence because of his situation and even my brain knows what I should/shouldn’t do, my heart would still rush me into it.

    My heart tells me not to miss out on this one :/ that’s why I ask questions here so that I could better manage 😅

    I guess we’ll find out :p

    #934269 Reply

    Raven

    Do you really want to be his rebound?

    #934270 Reply

    M

    I’m sorry Poppy, I’m come off rude and condescending and I didn’t mean that. I shouldn’t haven’t written it that way, I apologise 🙏

    You answered with class 😍😊

    I sincerely apologise.

    Let me rephrase. Using your words, the reason I thought you couldn’t handle it, is because I couldn’t. I was projecting.

    Maybe you can.

    I do this exercise where I check in with my head, my heart and my gut, and see what all three of them are saying. I learnt it from Tony Robbins. (Do you know him? He’s AMAZING! One of my heroes.) There’s a lot of research around the wisdom to be gained from these 3 places in your body. If memory serves well, I think they’re called your 3 brains by one of the researcher duos. I can’t remember the book title off the top of my head.

    When all 3 are aligned, I know I’m good and safe to go. Like it’s a brilliant powerful move and I should definitely definitely do it.

    Tony gives names to these wisdom centres… I think he calls the head “The Sovereign”, …. Actually I can’t remember the others now! I’ll have to look them up. (Also, i think…. I have a feeling maybe he checks in with the throat as well….).

    Anyway, the point is, normally when we think of our brain, we think of the one in our head. Yet our body holds memories and wisdom all throughout it. In every cell actually. And in certain parts of it, the nerves (or something… medics please don’t shoot me down if I’m wrong on the biology!) are localised.

    Certainly I know for sure we have chakras and major energy centres in those areas.

    My personal understanding is that it’s good to consult all of your brains/wisdom centres, because each one is a kind of specialist that will give you its unique opinion on the situation. They’ll give you a different perspective on the situation.

    My understanding and personal experience is that in most instances is, the heart is the seat of so much power and wisdom and magic. When you operate in the world from this place, you give so freely and abundantly and beautifully and purely, you can create wonderful wonderful things in the world. The people that you give to will benefit tremendously, and they’ll even feel it. You might even hear them say they feel touched. The language isn’t misleading, they felt your heart because you gave from this very pure powerful generous and selfless place.

    Normally I’d always advise a person to operate from this amazing powerful place. I try to operate from this place as much as possible myself.

    What I’ve personally discovered is, (and it may be different for you), is that I give far more than most people expect and usually with good results (unless I’m super tired and short on time as we evidenced earlier! Again I apologise!).

    It’s not an easy way to live necessarily, because giving so much can be personally costly. You’re freely giving away so much of your time, your energy and your love. And in a lot of situations there’s little to nothing to personally gain from the situation. The person may be grateful, but almost never matches the personal investment you make in them.

    I’m totally cool with that, because that’s what I’m all about. That for me is a worthwhile thing, a life well lived if you like. I do it for selfish reasons, because the paradox is, altruism feels so good, I guess it’s my drug if you like!!! 😅

    This all being said, there’s a key distinction to be made in terms of context.

    Inside a committed relationship, it is such a powerful way to live. You don’t keep score or live in a transactional way. You just give, even when it’s not fair and it’s not rational.

    There is wisdom in this, because you can help counter your partners deficiencies to a great extent and help bring them up. And because it’s inside a committed relationship, they won’t leave you or hang you out to dry in the end because they’re committed to you. The love always comes back to you from the same source and you benefit in the long run. (Caveat or note rather, loving from the heart is different from codependent relationships, you do what’s best for the other not what they want you to do).

    When you operate, give and follow solely from the heart outside of committed relationships, it’s a riskier strategy. People may appreciate it, they’ll be drawn to you for at least some time because they benefit in some way from your heart and generosity.

    But ultimately, people usually operate from their own agenda, because that’s how human beings are. Once they have all they need, they tend to go off and do their next thing, wherever their heart leads them.

    You have to have a really really strong heart and resilience to be able to deal with this, because it can be hurtful when you’ve given so much (and developed some attachment) and you’re left behind in the dust whilst they go on to conquer the next phase of their life, empowered by all the love and time and energy you’ve given them.

    My personal advice would be, in matters of romance where being left behind is potentially so much more devastating and debilitating than other relationships, always always always lead with your head before the guy has committed to you.

    Consulting and listening to, and being guided by your head in these circumstances, over and above your heart, will protect you from great hurt. The heart is powerful, but also vulnerable. Your head knows this, and it will guide you rationally.

    Guys definitely operate like this. Until they fall in love.

    We women are more emotional creatures, so it’s harder work for us to operate like this, even before we fall in love. And in romance it does not serve us. In fact it works to our detriment.

    Proximity is a powerful thing Poppy. The more time you spend with him, unless he’s a complete ass, the more likely feelings of attachment and affection and desire will arise (and sometimes even despite a guy being a complete ass!). This is heady stuff. If you’re even slightly confused now, expect that to increase as time goes on. Desire has felled and ruined many and countless lives.

    I myself have fallen victim to this awful trap more than once (or twice) (or three times) (or…. well, let’s just stop here shall we! . Ultimately I could not handle the emotional turbulence because overtime it became a tsunami of feeling. First positive taking me high, then massively negative crushing me completely afterwards.

    I could be wrong, but the pattern I went through, I see it in your posts with you. BUT of course I could be wrong. I might be projecting too strongly.

    Anyway, that’s what I meant when I wrote initially. I’m sorry I came off as a jerk! I should have phrased it better.

    Sending you love. 😊❤️
    I’m going to go back to bed now! Have a full day ahead, so maybe won’t get a chance to reply again for a bit. Hope you have a beautiful day. And stay safe Poppy. Protect your heart! You’re obviously such a smart and empathic girl, I’m sure you’re meant to go on and do great things in life. Choose someone who will lift you, you deserve at least that much, if not a whole lot more.x

    Also, if what I’ve said is off the mark, then as always, ignore! Your deep inner aligned wisdom trumps anything any outsider could tell you!

    #934272 Reply

    M

    PS, I’ve just seen I missed one of your questions. Yes I have done a 180 on what I originally suggested. For 2 reasons, your post describing about his 12year relationship and the potential for him to go back to his ex (who isn’t really an ex in his head or heart). And your penultimate post that I was replying to suggested that the intellectual awareness and reasoning was still being overshadowed by your emotions.

    I could be wrong now.

    But I think I was wrong initially to assist you in strategising. Or at the very least, term it in that way in this particular situation. As one of the smart ladies above put it, the aim is to be independent and objective and just assess how he shows up. And all I ended up leading you to do was try to control the outcome.

    I’m sorry I mislead you. 🙏

    You’ve taught me I should not post when I’m tired!

    Good job there are many great minds here on this forum to balance out perspectives 🙏🙏🙏

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